Soul Spy?

Onaix · Dec 16, 2014

Someone have made a Leaf Spy app where you can read SOC, voltage on each cell, GIDS etc. But we should have an equal app for the kia soul! I unfortunately can't programming, or else i would have made it in a heartbeat.
So i hope that if there are any programmers with the kia they would make this!

SiLiZiUMM · Mar 22, 2015

Hi,

I was looking for a tool like LEAF Spy for the Soul EV. To my understanding so far (including this post!), it doesn't exist.. yet! I am a programmer and I've worked with CAN Bus over the past, this project seems interesting!

We just pre-ordered a Soul a few weeks ago. It should arrive between 3-6 months! I can't wait to receive it so I can start working on this project!

TomT · Mar 22, 2015

Actually, it is harder and takes more time than you might think. Since none of the buss data is documented, it all has to be reverse engineered... The programming is actually the relatively easy part...

Onaix said:
Someone have made a Leaf Spy app where you can read SOC, voltage on each cell, GIDS etc. But we should have an equal app for the kia soul! I unfortunately can't programming, or else i would have made it in a heartbeat.

Turbo3 · Apr 19, 2015

Being the author of LeafSpy I would agree that the majority of the work is in reverse engineering the CAN bus messages.

For the Nissan Leaf there are actually three CAN buses available on the OBDII connector (CAR, EV and AV). If someone has access to a Service manual it could show the CAN bus structure used in the KIA Soul EV.

I have tools for capturing the CAN bus sequences but would need access to a KIA Soul EV.

AlKl · Aug 12, 2015

Hello,
are there any news concerning a Soul Spy SW?
Has anyone access to a service manual or a good connection to a mechanic (CAN ID's or even better CAN database file)?

Best Regards,
AlKl

mtndrew1 · Aug 13, 2015

If anyone needs a Soul EV in Los Angeles to experiment with, you're welcome to use mine, provided nothing warranty-voiding is going on.

edzee3 · Aug 13, 2015

AIKI,
Regarding availability of a Soul EV service manual, please contact me at [email protected]

SiLiZiUMM · Aug 14, 2015

I borrowed an OBD Bluetooth device last Friday from a colleague just to quickly check what I could see on the bus. I had no much time on hand, but the reader was able to see 2 ECUs.

Unfortunately I cannot continue for a while because we had an accident on Tuesday with the Soul (rear end impact)

The car was only 4 weeks old. As we had to wait forever to get the car, we will probably have to wait forever to have it repaired!

edzee3: I would be probably interested in those manuals as well. Is it the same info that can be found on http://www.kiatechinfo.com/ ?

user 285 · Aug 16, 2015

I started to look into this - I couldn't get any normal responses on the CAN on 7df, I wonder if I was using the wrong speed or something. The service manual has no info (as far as I can see) on OBD.

I randomly tried a Prius C database, and I got responses for 7e2 / 21xx, but I have no idea what the numbers mean!

Would really like to help create a SoulSpy App!

SiLiZiUMM · Aug 16, 2015

I registered for 72 hours on KiaTechInfo, interesting stuff in there for the price. I found some details about CAN:

I confirm what I've seen, there is 2 CAN links on the OBD-II connector (connectors are reverse pinout on the schematics, this is confusing, I'll use the same pinout as on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On-board_diagnostics ).
- Primary CAN is called C-CAN (Communication?), located on standard pins 6 (high) and 14 (low). From the other schematics, a lot of stuff is connected to C-CAN, including the main battery.
- A secondary CAN is called M-CAN (Multimedia?), located on pins 1 (high) and 9 (low). From the schematics, at least the A/V navigation unit and the instrument cluser is connected to this bus.
- Pin 12 is K-Line
- Pin 3 is Vehicle Speed Signal

There are also other CAN networks, like H-CAN and B-CAN, but they are not available from the OBD-II port. So this is different from the Leaf, which has a dedicated EV-CAN. Here, the EV information will be splitted between the C-CAN and the M-CAN.

There is no information on CAN messages on the site (I would not expect this anyway) but all DTC codes are documented. The CAN bus speeds are also documented at the same place:

Speed : 1Mbit/s for high speed CAN (probably H-CAN), up to 125 kbit/s on low speed CAN
Using ISO 11898 standard

jcallan: Do you have an actual service manual for the 2015/2016 as a PDF document or something?

user 285 · Aug 16, 2015

That's some very useful top-level information, should help to get us started! I guess the H-CAN and B-CAN are on the connector under the bonnet? I wondered what that was for.

Service manual: Yes, PM me with your email address...

EV2016 · Aug 16, 2015

SiLiZiUMM said:
I borrowed an OBD Bluetooth device last Friday from a colleague just to quickly check what I could see on the bus. I had no much time on hand, but the reader was able to see 2 ECUs.

Unfortunately I cannot continue for a while because we had an accident on Tuesday with the Soul (rear end impact) The car was only 4 weeks old. As we had to wait forever to get the car, we will probably have to wait forever to have it repaired!

edzee3: I would be probably interested in those manuals as well. Is it the same info that can be found on http://www.kiatechinfo.com/ ?

I just had to chime in and say sorry to hear about your accident. I had the same thing happen shortly after I bought my brand new T-Bird in 2002. It was a little older than 4 weeks old but it was my toy and I didn't drive it much. It spent a lot of time in the garage. We were on our way to have dinner with friends and we were sitting still on I-405 in Washington when the guy behind me hit the gas instead of the brake and smacked me in the rear. I don't remember the dollar amount of damage but it just wasn't the same after that. I wound up trading it in on a Prius and that began my journey into electrified vehicles. I hope they get your Soul back to you good as new.

JejuSoul · Sep 11, 2015

I have been looking through the service manual for clues about the CAN data. Sadly it is not there. There are numerous pictures of KIA's ODB software. Here is a screenshot of the different ECU's connected to the Chassis CAN.

user 285 · Sep 11, 2015

Hmmm, we need a friendly engineer at Kia to help us... perhaps we could persuade them that it is safer for them to tell us the codes we need than for us to try to find them!

AlKl · Sep 14, 2015

jcallan said:
Hmmm, we need a friendly engineer at Kia to help us...

That would help us a lot!

On the weekend i made some CAN Traces (~700MB):
The M_CAN has a speed of 100kbit/s and a avg. busload of only 8,46%. Maybe because the european version has no EVO system?
Following CAN ID's (11Bit) are sent: 100, 114, 115, 123, 130, 131, 132, 133, 171, 196, 197, 1C0, 1E5, 1E7, 440, 443, 44D, 490, 4B7, 4E8, 506, 531

The C_CAN has a speed of 500kbit/s and a avg. busload of 44,2%.
Following CAN ID's (11Bit) are sent: 18, 34, 50, 110, 120, 153, 160, 164, 465, 1F1, 200, 201, 202, 220, 291, 2A1, 2A2, 2B0, 2C0, 433, 47F, 4B0, 4B1, 4F0, 4F1, 4F2, 510, 517, 51A, 523, 524, 542, 55C, 55D, 55E, 55F, 561, 567, 570, 579, 57A, 57B, 57F, 581, 582, 587, 588, 58F, 590, 592, 594, 595, 596, 597, 598, 5A0, 5A2, 5E4, 5F0, 651, 652. 653, 654, 655, 656, 690

Maybe someone knows the content (CAN Database) of some ID's? Some ID's a probably also used in other KIA vehicles.
Pictures are in a german forum: http://www.goingelectric.de/forum/kia-soul-ev/ovms-fuer-den-soul-t9741.html#p247164

JejuSoul · Sep 15, 2015

Assuming we won't get inside help means we have to analyse this data ourselves.
The two free tools I have found so far are
1. CAN Message Analysis - by GaryG see http://www.wwwsite.com/puzzles/cando/
This was originally used to decode the Nissan Leaf CAN bus.
Big disadvantages is that is written in very old Visual Basic and we do not have the source code.

2.OVMS CAN-RE-TOOL to reverse engineer the codes. see http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/6754-Open-Vehicle-Monitor-System-%28OVMS%29-Technical-Discussion/page5?p=425902&viewfull=1#post425902
This was originally used to decode the Tesla Roadster.
These are open-source scripts written in Perl.

AlKl how did you get your data? What hardware/software? And would you be willing to upload the data and give us a link?

AlKl · Sep 15, 2015

JejuSoul said:
AlKl how did you get your data? What hardware/software? And would you be willing to upload the data and give us a link?

I'm using Vector CANalyzer 8 with a CANcaseXL (2 CAN ports) connected to the OBD Port (C_CAN and M_CAN).
The logfile is in ASCII format.
Next weekend i try to make a trace when loading, then there shouldn't be too much traffic on the bus and it should be possible to find at least the SOC of the battery.

Maybe someone can provide a location where everyone has access, so we can work together?
Uploading the trace wouldn't be a problem.

notfred · Sep 15, 2015

Has anyone tried signing up and seeing if they have some details at the Kia Tech Info website? https://kiatechinfo.snapon.com/Default.aspx

Ever · Sep 15, 2015

AlKl said:
JejuSoul said:

AlKl how did you get your data? What hardware/software? And would you be willing to upload the data and give us a link?

Click to expand...

I'm using Vector CANalyzer 8 with a CANcaseXL (2 CAN ports) connected to the OBD Port (C_CAN and M_CAN).
The logfile is in ASCII format.
Next weekend i try to make a trace when loading, then there shouldn't be too much traffic on the bus and it should be possible to find at least the SOC of the battery.

Maybe someone can provide a location where everyone has access, so we can work together?
Uploading the trace wouldn't be a problem.

I have no idea about this stuff, BUT I'm really appreciative that you guys are doing this.

Very excited to see the outcome of this project.

Keep up the good work folks!

JejuSoul · Sep 15, 2015

Hi Notfred - yes we have already looked at the Kia technical site.
These images for instance are from Kia's Diagnostic Software.

What we don't have is the CAN ID's that match each each data item to what it represents.
If we are lucky though the data shown above will be in simple sequential order.
Hence if we find value 1000 followed by 96 values that are all about 4.07
then I think we have found the battery cell voltages.

Soul Spy?

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