BMS software update

[notfred]

There have been reports of unscrupulous Leaf dealers doing a BMS reset to try and get rid of old Leafs, but this is the first I've heard of any form of reset on the Soul EV.

Hopefully just the firmware update. SoulEV2016 where did you hear about this update?

 

[Elmil]

As expected, my deterioration numbers were set again this night during charging 16-100%.
They are now Max: 9.5% and Min:7.5%.

Before the reset they had decreased from 13.2/11.7 to 11.4/9.9 so it might be a seasonal change which would have happened anyway.

This is also supported by the last few days DTE readings when leaving for work at 100% SOC:
151, 153, 155, 154, 158, 159 km (yesterday), but this morning it was 176 km. Haven't had such DTE numbers since ever...

So I guess all "filtering knowledge" for the GOM was lost too so it's starting over.

probably BMS firmware update to correct :
- kWh/Ah counting deviation
- and operating time deviation.

I don't think that would be a reason itself, these values were quite okay I think. But Kia might do it anyway.

 

[Elmil]

Also this morning the deterioration numbers had changed:
Max 9.5 (same), Min 7.1 (down from 7.5), same cells as yesterday.
Odometer 61304 km.

This time I started the charging at 52% and the update happened at 94.0% SOC. Update at these circumstances is a new behaviour, because all previous updates came at around 92% SOC after charging started below 30%. But the algorithm is likely more dynamic from the start.

 

[JejuSoul]

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Elmil: really interesting to hear about the new BMS firmware. Have you tried asking the Kia service techs why they did this?

There are also reports from Quebec of a BMS firmware update that fixes a battery heater bug.

...We know that when the temperature is too low the car doesn't preheat in the morning if the battery is full.
By too cold, from experience this is less than -18C
Some people managed to get an update that fixed this issue.

Here in Korea there are no reports of anyone receiving this update.

I have never had any ECU firmware updates on my Soul EV.

I have had an LDC firmware update on an I oniq EV I took for a test drive.
I wish we had the PID codes to list the ROM IDs in our Torque app.

 

[Elmil]

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Have you tried asking the Kia service techs why they did this?

Well, they didn't tell me they had in the first place. I just assume they always connect the KDS/GDS, log in to some service site and then things just happen.. :roll: I might just call and ask "innocently" why the Cumulative Operating Time on the battery report was just 11 minutes...

Only extra thing on the job order was a "Campaign", KCE16-71-P060. [PSEV A/C CONDENSING RECEIVER DRIER REPLACEMENT].
Seems like a drier filter for the A/C. Anyone else had this done?

 

[SoulEV2016]

yes, all models from 2014 to 2017 on French country.
http://www.automobile-propre.com/forums/kia-soul-ev/liste-des-rappels-kia-soul-ev-t6425.html

 

[Elmil]

My deterioration numbers have been going roller coaster since the BMS reset. New update every charge cycle. One thing I have never seen before is that updates have taken place even when the charging was started from higher SOC than 30%. In these cases the update happened at 94% SOC instead of the usual 92%.

Here's some overview, from the morning I went for service up til today:

Date   Odo	 SOC%in	Ah in  kWh in	DtMx DtMin	DTE
04/04	61032	51.5	38.0	14.4	11.4	9.9	158
04/05	61204	84.0	62.3	22.9	 9.5	7.5	177
04/06	61304	48.0	35.6	13.5	 9.5	7.1	176
04/07	61432	66.0	48.8	18.2	 9.1	5.8	177
04/10	61568	70.5	52.2	19.4	10.2	7.9	176
04/11	61671	50.5	37.4	14.2	 9.2	5.5	175

 

[JejuSoul]

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Hi Elmil.
I am not adding your current battery data yet to the database I keep, because I don't know whether this is truly a new algorithm or not. If it is, I will start a new trendline with your car from the date they made the change. The N issan L eaf that had the BMS reset (look up VIN 2222) took a few months to adjust back to its original and correct level. Yours is the first Soul EV on our forum to have the BMS reset so I will wait and see how long it takes to adjust.
All the changes you write about are not unfamiliar. In fact my car behaves more like your current one than it did before.

My deterioration numbers have been going roller coaster since the BMS reset...

That is how my numbers have always been. A reminder from a few weeks ago, just before they reset your BMS.

Thanks Elmil. As always your numbers are close together and rising slowly...
My trendline is much the same as yours, but my individual datapoints are much more varied. As they always have been.

...updates have taken place even when the charging was started from higher SOC than 30%...

Yes, my numbers have always behaved like that.

... the update happened at 94% SOC instead of the usual 92%....

We have also seen this difference before, yet again it was my car that behaved like your car is doing now. From the battery calibration thread.

Calibration after 94% is different to what I see in my car. I always have the calibration at 392.5 +/-0.1V battery voltage, 4.08V (0xCC) cell voltage and 91.5-92.5% SOC.
I use the 2.0kW E VSE that came with the car, if you charge using more power perhaps that is the difference.

 

[Elmil]

.
Update on deterioration of my newly resetted BMS:

Date   Odo    SOC%in   Ah in  kWh in   DtMx DtMin   DTE
04/04   61032   51.5   38.0   14.4   11.4   9.9   158
04/05   61204   84.0   62.3   22.9    9.5   7.5   177
04/06   61304   48.0   35.6   13.5    9.5   7.1   176
04/07   61432   66.0   48.8   18.2    9.1   5.8   177
04/10   61568   70.5   52.2   19.4   10.2   7.9   176
04/11   61671   50.5   37.4   14.2    9.2   5.5   175
04/12   61771   50.0   37.1   14.1    8.8   5.5   174
04/19   62750   53.5   40.0   15.1    8.6   5.1   162

So the first week there was changes every workday. We've had chilly weather the last week and the daily updates stopped (still, possibly unrelated to weather conditions). I went for a road trip during Easter weekend, 780km and a couple of chademo DCQC. I expected the deterioration numbers to begin rising again, but instead they continued down today after going back to normal commute.

There is one more interesting change I noticed when using the DC fast c hargers (first time since the reset) - the blue LED indications are now active during DCQC just as they always have when using the OBC. Never done that before. Seems like a software update of the OBC.
Anyone knows if/when this was introduced? MY2016?

 

[JejuSoul]

....There is one more interesting change I noticed when using the DC fast c hargers (first time since the reset) - the blue LED indications are now active during DCQC just as they always have when using the OBC. Never done that before. Seems like a software update of the OBC. Anyone knows if/when this was introduced? MY2016?

Yes, I think that changed occurred for the MY2016. My car May 2015 does not have the Chademo lights. But cars from June 2015 do.
I wish we could see the ROM IDs of the various ECUs to check what it is they updated in your car.

Here's a photo from a S onata PHEV.

 

[Elmil]

I've just visited a friend who also bought a 2015 Soul EV, just a month after me. He is now over 60000 km too, and I thought I should go there and check the BMS values in his car to get more statistics.

But he had the 60000 km service done only a couple of days earlier, and I found that the same software upgrades as I got had been done to his. So no deterioration, energy counters or active seconds counter (well, 13 hours...). Also the blue indications were now active during Quickcharge as in my car.

He's service wasn't done by the same garage as mine, so now it really looks like it wasn't a mistake and this upgrade might come to everyone (maybe at 60000 km / 40000 miles..). In that case, Kia must have a database where they save the old statistics from the BMS, before they do the upgrade.

I have noted a different behaviour on the cell balancing when Quickharging: It seems they have moved the balancing process from 82% SOC to 92%. My friend was actually surprised the first time he used QC after service, because it was finished quicker than it used to. For me, the 84% QC:s I've done since the upgrade have all passed without any signs of cell balancing, but the only time I've restarted to 94% I could see the signs in the log afterwards, even if it was pretty short.

My det.numbers since last report (11 changes after BMS upgrade):
Det Max: 8.5-8.1-8.1-8.6
Det Min: 6.6-4.9-5.7-6.3

 

[JejuSoul]

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I would like this thread to be renamed 'BMS software update'. I think that title is more appropriate for this topic. Elmil, can you go back to the first post in the thread and rename it there. That way it will show up in the listings under that title.

On the German Forum there are reports from owners who have had this update, and they are very confused about what it may or may not do.
see - Aktuelle Software-Versionen?!

My KIA workshop master (EV fan ) Has also carried out SW updates on the occasion of the OBC exchange in the last week.
...
He said something else:
It is now also an update of the battery management on it - and - this should lead to more favourable consumption.

German users also seem to think that the BMS upgrade will change the Chademo endpoint for a single charge from 83% to 94% on older model versions to make it compatible with the MY2017. Elmil does yours do this?

 

[Elmil]

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I would like this thread to be renamed 'BMS software update'. I think that title is more appropriate for this topic. Elmil, can you go back to the first post in the thread and rename it there. That way it will show up in the listings under that title.

On the German Forum there are reports from owners who have had this update, and they are very confused about what it may or may not do.
see - Aktuelle Software-Versionen?!

My KIA workshop master (EV fan ) Has also carried out SW updates on the occasion of the OBC exchange in the last week.
...
He said something else:
It is now also an update of the battery management on it - and - this should lead to more favourable consumption.

German users also seem to think that the BMS upgrade will change the Chademo endpoint for a single charge from 83% to 94% on older model versions to make it compatible with the MY2017. Elmil does yours do this?

No single charge to 94%, still need restart. But as I noted in another thread, there are new Delta chademos that autostart when you plug in, and also auto restart at 83%. Not related to BMS update though.

I think maybe 'a more favourable consumption' is more related to the reset of the DTE (guess-o-meter), which went up for me after the update, but now it is back to normal again. I am more concerned about the cell balancing, which now might be less active due to being activated in the second chademo pass at 92%.

 

[JejuSoul]

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Some cars in Quebec have now had the BMS upgrade.
For them it seems to have been done to fix a pre-heating bug that occurs in very cold weather.

A video of the bug is here -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyL8kisDx0w

The fix for this is - campaign 170055.
In Quebec it is called 'BMS logic for climate control system improvement' number 170055.
It upgrades the battery management system of certain Soul EVs MY2015 and MY2016. The Temperature Control System of these models may not function when the vehicle is exposed to low temperatures without starting for a certain time.




In the US the BMS software update is known as Service Action 297




and two screens from torque -





Here's some photos of the notice.
Most interesting to me was the list of ROM IDs

 

[Elmil]

.
Catching up for a passed summer..

Yesterday I had the 75000 km service. The SOH value is now 99.7%. My deterioration numbers changed the night before to 11.0/8.9.
There was a firmware upgrade of the OBC. Have not seen any functional differences yet, but the OBD2 data format has changed, so now the format seems the same as the MY16+ cars (AC AMP value moved).

Other than this, the summer has passed just fine, with a bit more QC than normal due to road trips. In juli I took the annual range check trip and I drove 206.1km with 4.5% SOC left. BMS said 23.7 kWh consumed and odometer just below 70000 km.

 

[notfred]

Just took my 2016 in for its 2 year service today. They performed an OBC update/inspection/replacement that I'll discuss in the OBC failure thread, but also there was an update listed as:

15K1Z Recalls
PS EV BMS Logic for climate control system improvement"

While the heat pump is driven from the high voltage supply, I wonder if the "climate control" here is more the battery heater and cooling fan?

 

[Elmil]

Just took my 2016 in for its 2 year service today. They performed an OBC update/inspection/replacement that I'll discuss in the OBC failure thread, but also there was an update listed as:

15K1Z Recalls
PS EV BMS Logic for climate control system improvement"

While the heat pump is driven from the high voltage supply, I wonder if the "climate control" here is more the battery heater and cooling fan?

Yes, it seems plausible that it's related to the climate control in the battery. If so, we will perhaps notice something during winter.

Did your counters for cumulative kWh, Ah and active time, as well as the deterioration numbers reset, as they did for me?

 

[notfred]

Did your counters for cumulative kWh, Ah and active time, as well as the deterioration numbers reset, as they did for me?

Sorry, I haven't been tracking them. My range this morning looked higher than usual by about 10km so I suspect things did get reset and it will drop back as it learns the way I drive and the temperatures.

 

[JejuSoul]

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This upgrade seems to be for cold weather climates only.
I did not get the BMS upgrade at my recent service.
He checked all the ECUs, and the only one requiring an update was the EPB.

 

[irfca]

I had campaign 170055 applied to MY15, I believe at a service in late August (vs when I had my charger replaced for a 2nd time back in June). It has not made any difference to the DCQC and "Blue light" indicator - it still doesn't come on, and it also has not changed the battery rebalance point - it is still happening at 82% ... are both of these changes expected with that BMS update? Did they mess it up on me? Having the balance point move to 92% would help me a lot - as the weather gets colder, I use a DCQC 3-4 times a week, and being able to go up to at least 84% if not a bit higher, would be of tremendous help - I currently stop at 80% because it takes 3-4 minutes to move past the 81% point (around 95,000km)

Ian.