Harder braking and battery died

[jmflsoulev]

I have a 2015 Kia Soul EV and live in Florida. I bought it used with 11,000 miles on it and now have 29,000. When I found it we asked the local dealer if they worked on EVs and they said yes. This ended up not being true and when we went to have the recall work done it had to be transported to Georgia . We also wanted them to look at the battery health. Our range had dropped from 90 to 65 in one night and it seemed something was not right.

They reset our battery and said it was up to 112 and sent it home. It rapidly dropped of course and now 4 months later it is now 36. I contacted consumer affairs after I saw it rapidly dropping and said to reopen the case as it wasn’t fixed and they never performed a battery check.

Over the last 3 weeks when I have had to brake a bit harder, the car dies. I have to hold down the start button to shut it off completely then restart it. I reported this but I have not seen anyone else mention this issue.

I had a great case manager the first time but now am assigned to someone who has only called me once and left a message. I have called her back everyday and left messages. Now it says her mailbox is full. I called the main number to ask for someone else. They said they don’t reassign. They put 2 no call backs on her record and still nothing. I finally got to a supervisor and they told me they would try to get it attention and to give them 3 more days. Meanwhile I am driving so carefully to not put on my brakes and have my car shut down on busy streets.

I love my Soul ev, but wouldn’t buy it again. I think the air cooled battery doesn’t work great in Florida. My husband has a volt and the different cooking makes all the difference. No degradation at all on a 2016 with 40k mikes on it while I’m estimating a 60% degradation on my Kia.

Has anyone else had an issue with harder braking and battery degradation?

 

[notfred]

I think that you have 2 issues going on:

1) Hard braking car dies. This one concerns me, I suspect that you have an issue on your 12V system - the brakes need 12V to pump up the brake boost pressure and also 12V is needed to turn on the high voltage battery relay. I would get your 12V battery checked for condition / loose cables etc. Any mechanic can do this - the 12V system is just like a gasoline car.

2) Your high voltage battery is dying and needs replacement (or at least replacement of some cells). It sounds like the dealer just did an update of the Battery Management System (BMS). This resets all the values that the BMS has learned about your battery and so it initially reports the good range until the BMS has had a chance to learn about your battery.

 

[JejuSoul]

..
Over the last 3 weeks when I have had to brake a bit harder, the car dies. I have to hold down the start button to shut it off completely then restart it. I reported this but I have not seen anyone else mention this issue.
...

This is a serious safety issue. I do not think you should continue to drive this car until the braking issue is fixed.
No one has ever mentioned this issue before.
There are two braking systems on an EV. The regular friction brakes, and regenerated braking into the HV battery.
Even if the battery failed the friction brakes should still work. Something else is wrong.

..
I think the air cooled battery doesn’t work great in Florida.
...

Yes. Cars in Arizona, California, Georgia and Texas are all failing early because of the heat.
Re: Arizona SOUL EV Heat testing

I wrote in that thread 18 months ago - A proper liquid cooling system for the battery seems essential.

 

[jmflsoulev]

Thank you for your responses.

Re: Harder braking and battery died
by notfred » Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:12 am

1) Hard braking car dies. This one concerns me, I suspect that you have an issue on your 12V system - the brakes need 12V to pump up the brake boost pressure and also 12V is needed to turn on the high voltage battery relay. I would get your 12V battery checked for condition / loose cables etc. Any mechanic can do this - the 12V system is just like a gasoline car.

We had the 12v battery replaced last month as the battery read bad. I will get it checked again. There might be something wrong in the 12v system.

2) Your high voltage battery is dying and needs replacement (or at least replacement of some cells). It sounds like the dealer just did an update of the Battery Management System (BMS). This resets all the values that the BMS has learned about your battery and so it initially reports the good range until the BMS has had a chance to learn about your battery.

The dealer that Kia transported to was very condescending and asked if I used a Kia cable for charging. I said no as we had a level 2 charger that worked fine for the first year we had it and we use it on our volt. They seemed to think if I didn't use the level 1 charger which takes 24 hours to charge that no other charger would work. I told them the battery read 100%, so it would be a battery issue and not power going to it. Kia said they would transport to another dealer this time once I can get them to move on it.

Update: My local dealer is going to push the issue with Kia Consumer Affairs as they saw the safety concern and they can't help me with it.

 

[skorp77]

I also am having the same problem.
We live in the hill country of Texas so end up using more braking going down hills. When you brake hard there is a thump and the EV system cuts out, the friction brakes still work normaly.
I took it to the dealer in Round Rock Tx. and they did an update on the BMS, so the GOM showed 121 when I picked it up. I'm sure that will fall rapidly.
My belief is that the EV battery is not taking the regen power as it is worse when then power level shows 90% or higher. Once the BMS has readjusted I will take it back, which means putting on my trailer and a 140 mi. one way trip.

 

[JejuSoul]

-
I now think my reply above that suggested this was a serious safety issue because of faulty brakes was wrong.
It is regen braking that fails because of a bad battery. The real brakes are fine.

I have seen this issue on a severely degraded battery. A 2011 Hyundai Blueon EV..
Here's a quote I wrote in July this year. - DC Charging not Working

The probable reason you can't fast charge is because your battery is really bad. I have had this issue on a Hyundai BlueON EV. Very easy to check. Just find a steep mountain road. A very degraded battery will not be able to accelerate up nor regen down.
The advice is simple, start the process of getting a replacement battery under warranty. Just look around this forum for numerous threads detailing how to do this.

 

[olisdad]

we had same issue with our 2016 with 56k. seemed like battery didn't like high regen.
car also had reduced range, 50-60 miles and SOH around 50. took it to the dealer expecting the typical treatment,
explained situation to the tech and asked that they drive the car for an extended period. on test drive
the car faulted as described, tech called kia and they authorized a new battery. 100+ mile range now

imo thats a serious safety issue. not cool having your car stall out in them middle of traffic.

 

[JejuSoul]

-
The standard advice for any car that stalls while driving is -

If the engine quits while you’re driving, the car will first lose power steering and then power brakes. Your first course of action should be to apply the foot brake and steer gradually over to the side of the road. Then, turn on your hazard lights and try to restart your car.

The specific advice for an electric car where regenerative braking fails unexpectedly is that the High Voltage battery needs to be checked for severe degradation. When it happened to me I was comfortable restarting the car and driving home slowly. I took the car to be serviced the next day.