I only get 50 km, 2015 Soul estimates 130.

[Wizfinger]

Hi all,

Bought a used Kia Soul EV 2015 (Netherlands / Europe). Actually it came from Germany, I am the second owner. It has about 90.000 km on the odometer.

When fully charged, it estimates I can drive 130 km (which seems a bit low but not too bad). When driving, I only get about 50 km and then the battery has 3% left. It goes into low power mode and I have to slowly drive to reach the charging station.

Basically, every time I get less than half of what the car GOM estimates at 100%.

I drive calmly, around 80-100 km/h, always in cruise control, with no climate systems active, nor any seat or steering wheel heating, no heavy accelerating, it shows a usage of about 17 kWh / 100 km.

I know it’s a few years old, but shouldn’t I be getting more mileage?

Thanks!

 

[ZuinigeRijder]

Buy an Konwei OBDII dongle and read out the State Of Health (SOH) and battery cells with either Soul Spy Lite or Torque Pro on an Android phone. You are from the Netherlands? I have a Kia Soul 2014 with almost 140.000 km and SOH of 91% in the Netherlands. With this winter temperatures around 0 degrees Celcius I also see less range than usual (105 km when 100% charged) and short trips do not help. I can get more km when driving longer distances. Previously my GOM gave me more km, but then I traveled to my work twice 40 km.

 

[notfred]

I wonder if your battery is bad but the BMS has been reset and hasn't learnt how bad the battery is yet so it is showing you close to the default range.

Definitely read the SoH but also look at the Cumulative values for charged and discharged and see if they are low. If the Cumulative values are low then the BMS has been reset recently and the BMS hasn't learnt the battery SoH. Check the cell map to see if any cells are a different voltage to the rest - usually when a battery goes bad its just a few cells and they show lower voltage when discharged and higher voltage when charged.

 

[JejuSoul]

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I also think you have a problem with the battery. It needs to be replaced under warranty. You should find out the status of your warranty. Does the German warranty apply in Holland or will you need to drive the car back to Germany to get it fixed there.
Almost all of us on this forum use km. There is no need to convert anything to miles.

 

[Wizfinger]

Thanks for your replies. I changed the topic to km

I also think the battery is weak, or perhaps the battery heating? Sometimes the "low power mode" is activated when the battery is at 40%.

Unfortunately I don't have an Android phone and no iOS app seems to be able to read the Soul EV. Warranty is worldwide, luckily, as long as the car has been maintained by official KIA dealerships. Which it has. Next monday I have an appointment with the local KIA dealership.

I really hope it can be fixed, so I really hope the battery SOH is worse than 70%, or else they may refuse to fix it. If not, what else is there to do?

 

[NorSoul]

Welcome to the club. I would think your SOH is under 70%. My SOH is 72% and I get 50-55km range now. I live in Norway, and I would think temperatures here are lower than NL.

But given your high GOM estimates I’m not sure if it’s recalibrated after being reset by software update. My GOM shows 66km and I get around 10km lower range than that.

If the SOH reading is higher than 70% I would try to recalibrate it by discharging below 20% and charging to over 90%. But that’s not easy in the winter, as the battery percentage isn’t necessarily correct! My car is empty at 20-30%, so I’m unable to recalibrate mine now. It’s been at 72% for months.

 

[EVDee]

Also worth noting - no battery calibration occurs when the outside temperature is below 10C

I really don't think this is factored in enough when people give advice regarding battery calibration. Depending on the usage pattern (or lack of) it may be a really long time since a calibration was last done. The dealer may not know this either, mine didn't..

With all that said, given how low your range is and the fact that you go into a low power state at 40%: I suspect you are below the 70% threshold. The low power state makes me think that you actually have a bad cell or cells which are falling out of balance with the rest of the pack - thus putting you into Turtle mode.

I've had mine replaced recently, and all I can say is: good luck!

 

[IanL]

As you don't have an Android phone, do you have an Android tablet (e.g. Kindle Fire)? Kindle Fire works for me.

 

[NorSoul]

Also worth noting - no battery calibration occurs when the outside temperature is below 10C

I really don't think this is factored in enough when people give advice regarding battery calibration. Depending on the usage pattern (or lack of) it may be a really long time since a calibration was last done. The dealer may not know this either, mine didn't..

With all that said, given how low your range is and the fact that you go into a low power state at 40%: I suspect you are below the 70% threshold. The low power state makes me think that you actually have a bad cell or cells which are falling out of balance with the rest of the pack - thus putting you into Turtle mode.

I've had mine replaced recently, and all I can say is: good luck!

I suspected it wouldn’t calibrate in cold weather, but my dealer said temperature didn’t matter when I asked. Sometimes I think people on the internet knows more than the people selling and servicing the cars..

 

[JejuSoul]

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The reason we know the official details about calibration is because it is in the manual.
This is what every dealer should have read before doing an update.
In practice none ever do.
We have never heard of a case where the customer has been informed that the BMS was reset.
Instead we always hear reports that the dealer thinks the problem of low SOH has been fixed by an update.

A manual for updating the BMS is here - Service Action: Battery Management System (BMS) Logic Improvement (SA297)

In it we learn that battery calibration actually occurs as the battery is charged from less than 20% SOC to more than 90% SOC

Inform the customer that the BMS update will reset the adaptive learning values to default conditions. As a result, the displayed range/DTE (Distance to Empty) and charge times may be temporarily increased. It does not affect the actual range or battery charging time. These displayed values will gradually be relearned to reflect the actual battery condition with multiple drive and charge cycles performed above 50°F (10°C) from less than 20% SOC to more than 90% SOC.

For more details about calibration see - Battery Calibration

 

[Wizfinger]

Thanks all!

Regarding the Android: nope I only have Apple gear here. Maybe I can borrow from a neighbour, but I’ll have to buy the dongle first.

Regarding calibration: good to know it won’t calibrate below a certain temperature. Currently it is around 0-5°C where I live so I assume the car is not calibrating and the GOM does not “guess” correctly.

Yesterday and today I did the same test route. Exact same results. In the first part when the battery goes from 100 to 30%, I get about 45 km of range. Then down to about 1-4% in 10 km. Total distance is about 55 km.

I tried driving slower (95 instead of 100 km/h and 75 instead of 80) and this gives me a tiny bit more, which is expected.

I tried with climate (heating) on at 17°C and climate off, which almost makes no difference.

Today I accidentally tapped on the “Range” map. It showed me a map with circles which made me laugh I uncontrollably . I could NEVER get that far on a single charge.

 

[Wizfinger]

Today my battery was 100%, GOM said 140 km. I drove for 15 km at 80 km/h speed. Now the GOM says 90 km left.

Just to be sure... this is not normal, right? Next Monday I will talk to Kia and I want to stand strong.

 

[JejuSoul]

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No. It is not normal. There are a couple of unlikely possibilities that aren't a bad battery.

1/ Climate. Yesterday was +20C and today is -20C. And the GOM is adjusting to that fact.

2/ Road Conditions. Yesterday you drove down a steep mountain, and today you are driving up.

Common sense suggests these are very unlikely. If for some reason you have a really bad battery, but the car won't calibrate and SOH stays above 70% then KIA should use the distance estimates to justify the warranty claim.

 

[Wizfinger]

Thank you. Climate is stable here. It is winter (around 0°C) but nothing crazy.

As for mountains: they don’t exist in the Netherlands. Being in the rural county of Friesland, everything is flat as a pancake.

Next Monday I’ll go to Kia and report back here. Additional fun fact is that for the first time in at least ten years, temperatures will drop to -10°C. I hope I can make it to the dealership which is 20 km away

 

[Wizfinger]

Of course of course.... the dealership took a look and did a lot of measurements and they claim the battery is in good health and that it is perfectly normal to get less range as it is cold weather and the heater will use a lot of power.

I told them I disagree and that only 50-55 km of range is way too low. I asked them if they know the battery state of health and they told me they do not know.

I told them that if they officially take the stance that this car is perfectly normal, I want that in writing and I will contact KIA in the Netherlands to claim my warranty.

Then he told me he will talk to the mechanic again and get back to me.

 

[EVDee]

There's a reason why I said good luck. They'll come through in the end but be ready for your sanity to be put to the test in the meantime.
Often you're going to know more than they do, and the only thing I can suggest is being polite but firm when they're giving you incorrect information. The fact that you called their bluff and requested their determination in writing was a smart countermove on your behalf.

Personally I think your biggest obstacle is getting a recalibrated reading during the winter/spring season. Perhaps the dealership can do it for you as they can park it inside their shop to overcome the temperature limitation. Short of that or an unusually warm day..

 

[Wizfinger]

Thank you for your tips, indeed I may have to wait until spring to get it to calibrate better.

It baffles me that that they really actually tell me that this range depletion is normal when it's winter, also on newer models. Dutch winters are typically slightly above 0 ºC. If they sell a new car in the winter, will any customer accept a range of less than 50% advertised?

 

[notfred]

No that's not normal. I'm in Ottawa, Canada where we get -20C in the winter, sometimes colder. At the worst my winter range is 2/3 of my summer range.

From this and your other threads, you have a bad battery.

 

[Wizfinger]

Thanks, your information really helps.

The Kia dealership now has admitted they don't have much experience with this model so they have to find out everthing on the phone with Kia HQ Netherlands.

They returned my car and told me they cannot do a SOH measurement because it is not calibrated. The battery management was reset last december, as they found out.

They told me that I need to discharge the battery below 20% and then charge to 100%, do this cycle 5 times, and then they can determine SOH. So in the coming days I will do that.

In the meantime, I have ordered a cheap Android phone and the Konnwei OBD2 dongle, so I can start mesuring things myself.

 

[EVDee]

5 Cycles? Interesting..

Unless they actually know something that we don't, I'm still of the opinion that whether it's 5 cycles or 50, it won't matter unless the temperature is warm enough to allow for recalibration in the first place.

Frustrating, but at least you're making progress now.