Kia Battery Replacement Frustrations [HELP/ADVICE]?

[Tcalp]

Has anyone else had trouble getting Kia to warranty their battery on their Soul EV ? I can't get more than 80KM out of a charge, nor can I seem to put more than ~17-18kW of energy into the battery. I have had my car into the dealer(s) six or seven times now, many times paying out of pocket. Several cases for replacement have been made by the dealer, but KTAC/Kia Canada keeps refusing the replacement. I can't imagine what will happen this winter, as last winter was quite bad. I am nearly at the end of my warranty coverage and not sure what to do at this point.

Part of me is considering contacting local news stations, or filing a law suit, but either seems a process I'd rather not do.

 

[IanL]

What does the dealer say the SOH is?

 

[Tcalp]

The first time I brought it in they said 97%, last time I brought it in they said 85%

 

[Tcalp]

On the larger range, I am taking the car down to 3-6% and re-charging to 94% via L3

Notice the kWh delivered, again, from 3-6% (not sure which) to 94%

All of these photos and additional ones have been provided to Kia Service / KTAC.

 

[JejuSoul]

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From the ABB charging data screen I would estimate your SOH to be around 65%. I don't know when this was taken.
From the 80km drives I would also estimate your SOH to be around 65%. This was back in June.

The SOH on my car varied by as much as 5%, depending on season, driving use and temperature.
I got a replacement battery authorised on a day that showed 69.5%, but kept the car for another 3 months while waiting for the replacement pack to arrive. In that time the SOH went back up above 70%. Maybe because the weather got cooler.

Hence it is possible that in June your car was legitimately above 70% SOH and not valid for warranty.
However the August screenshot of the Low EV Battery Warning is a strong sign that something is wrong with your pack.
For the ---km to appear the car only has a few km left.

I suggest you download the SoulEVSpy app and post the cell voltages. I think one or more of the cells has gone bad.
In the past when this happened the value for SOH as shown by SoulEVSpy or by Kia is also bad, but it may be that the fault in your car is such that the value for SOH is incorrect. In this case real data such as how far it drives, how much it charges and the cell voltages should be used instead of the SOH. You will need to persuade Kia Canada of this. And you will need recent data. The images from June and August won't convince them.

 

[Tcalp]

I got SoulEV Spy today, it says my battery is at 78% SOH, here is a battery cell map.

I did another charge test today (took photos), intentionally drained my battery down to 5% and re-charged to 94%. I was able to consume 15.03kWh of power from the charging station (I assume about 90% of that actually makes it into the battery).

 

[Tcalp]

Also , August was like 12 days ago

 

[Tcalp]

The problem that I am having is that Kia Canada "customer service", at the supervisor level, has told me that there is nothing that they can do. I've equally had two different service centers/dealers tell me that there is nothing more that they can do.

 

[JejuSoul]

I got SoulEV Spy today, it says my battery is at 78% SOH, here is a battery cell map.

To me that cell map is an obvious sign that you have a bad battery.
It looks like numerous cells have gone bad, possibly 4 entire modules.
This is very unusual, we have not seen this before.

That SoulEVSpy gives a normal result, is because the BMS itself does not know how to ***** the true capacity of this battery.
Kia will use the same erroneous BMS value.

I suggest you focus on the fact that the battery is faulty. The warranty also replaces faulty batteries.

 

[notfred]

To me that whole battery pack looks quite out of balance.

Are you always charging on L3? Do you ever take it down below 20% and then let it charge to 100% on L2 until it shuts off? The last bit of charging does a cell balancing and I wonder if you are always charging on L3 if it doesn't get to do that, and that means that it also isn't properly working out what the SOH of the cells are.

 

[Tcalp]

Yes, I charge on both L1/L2 fairly regularly, and pretty much always starting charges below 20%.

I did a charge test on L3 yesterday, where I drew my battery down to 5% and re-charged to 94%, and this is the result:

 

[JejuSoul]

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I don't think your graphics from the L3 chargers are adding any useful information.

Please show some some data from a slower charge to 100%

From the Battery University Page about Calibration.
For a calibration to occur this needs to happen.

After that a range test. Drive at a steady 80km/h and see how far you can go.
Take a lot of data from the car while you are doing this.

To see a range test of the Soul EV done by a EV Pro I recommend -

My car was the subject of Tony Williams' Soul EV range test posted on InsideEVs.com in October 2014. http://insideevs.com/kia-soul-ev-range-autonomy-demonstration-nets-100-miles/

https://youtu.be/AR3NCObaPW0

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[user 284]

Hi, all.

Anybody had a main battery pack replacement under warranty? And how did that go?

My 2015 Soul EV, with about 34,000 miles, on a full charge says I only have about 64 miles range - in 70-degree weather. Last year at this time, it would read around 100 miles range. Since 64 is less than 70% of EPA rating of 93 miles, is that low enough to request battery replacement?

Or should I use Soul EV Spy to document SOH -- and what dongle did you buy to get it to work?

Update: I read the Soul EV Spy app info, suggesting purchasing a Konnwei KW902. Found one on Amazon for less than $6 (because it's red? The green, orange and black ones were more). Once I receive it, will Kia take an SOH printout from this as evidence of battery replacement under warranty?

 

[notfred]

Kia will only take the SoH from their own GDS tool run by their dealers as proof that the battery needs replacement. What the Soul Spy SoH will give you is an idea of whether the dealer is likely to agree that the battery needs replacement.

 

[Tcalp]

I got my car back from the dealer yesterday, having the latest BMS update and my vehicle charged to 100% (and left to balance) on their L2 charger. Had new low rolling resistance tires installed, brakes serviced and pads shaved, and an alignment done to ensure my vehicle is operating at the best possible efficiency. I drove home with a mix of city / highway driving 38.4KM and consumed 52% of my battery without heat or AC on. Not looking forward to having to drive this car over the coming winter...

To this point, I've spend over $2,000 out of pocket at dealers request to ensure my vehicle is in 'tip top' shape and to have BMS read outs over the last year. I've now had my car into the dealer 8 times, and am request to return on a bi-weekly basis for the next several months. I don't even want to think about the loss wages and taxi expenses added to that.

SIGH

 

[EVDee]

Yikes!

There's a lot I'd like to say, but frankly I think you just want a solution rather than hindsight.

TLDR:
Stop spending money at that dealership!
Get yourself an OBD2 reader, an Android device and SoulSpy.
Escalate!
Good Luck!

First: Stop spending money at that dealership!

While all those services are legitimate, were the actually needed?
I bought my car at ~115,000km over a year ago and currently have 149,000km on the odometer. I've been to my dealership at least 6 times and have yet to pay a dime for anything. Every time they've done a BMS check. Once they did a BMS "update", and the last time they did a BMS check while also doing a brake recall/update.
It's good your car had those services done, but frankly I'm of the opinion that their motives aren't in your favor. Checking the BMS takes them 5 minutes (seen it first hand) and involves nothing more than plugging in a little dongle, waiting for about 10-20 seconds, results pop up on their handheld tablet, and they unplug the dongle. That's it - other than them sending it off to corporate for warranty approval.

Second: Get yourself an OBD2 reader, an Android device and SoulSpy. (if you haven't already)

In my experience with my on-going warranty saga: it was only when I told them that I had an OBD2 reader and app that they changed their tune. Up until that point, State of Health wasn't a thing, that the battery was fine and that only when an error light pops up that there is an issue..etc etc.
It's also an amazing tool and every EV owner should have one.

Third: Escalate!

On your next check, don't pay or buy anything, and tell them that they need to resolve this sooner than later. Whether you contact Kia Corporate before or after is your choice, I've decided to wait until my next BMS check just because I'm more curious to what they'll come up with as an excuse vs my actual need for the battery to be replaced (as of yet..). Regardless, it seems that Kia is hesitating now with battery replacements vs before, but it seems those who escalate it with corporate get results - however yours experience may vary.

And lastly: Good Luck!

I've been dealing with this since July and I swear I'm going to have quite the story to tell by the end of it. Unbelievable, but hopefully persistence wins in the end.

 

[GLuv]

Here’s my battery issue and service journey.

I bought a used lease return 2015 KIA Soul EV a year ago. I understood that the range would be less than what the new car would be but when I started driving it it was quite a bit below 62 miles vs the 92 new. I used that to negotiate the price down when I bought it. I figured if it the battery was bad it would be covered by the warranty and I’d get a new battery pack.

After driving it for about 6 months and seeing the real mileage drop to about 45 miles. I decided to take it in to my local KIA dealer. They replaced the 12v battery and reset the BMS. No change in driving range.

I went to two different KIA service departments after the first service visit (who claimed they had certified technicians) which did the same thing... reset the BMS. Same results. I finally called the US customer service and got some straight answers.

First... resetting the BMS only made the mileage look better. It’s a sign that your dealer’s service Dept doesn’t know what it’s doing with EVs.

Second... there are only a hand full of dealers on the US east coast that deal with KIA EVs. Fortunately I had once close to me (25 miles away).

Third... this isn’t new to this forum but I’ll repeat it... you have to ask for a battery SOH (state of health) test. Your car will need to be at 100% charge for them to call it “official”.

My results were that my battery SOH came back at 68% (so under the 70% warranty bar). They are asking HQ what other tests need to be done. I’m hopeful. I’ve been at the dealer for 5 hours today so I’m ready for some good news.

 

[ksoul2084]

Wow that's a tedious process.

It sounds like you should be on your way now with regards to getting the warranty replacement. Be warned that this can often take weeks to accomplish. Hopefully KIA will provide a loaner car for you to use in the meantime if required.

 

[Tcalp]

@EVDee , I've done all of that.

I'll be taking my car in again this friday, and no they don't provide a loaner. I'll have to taxi from and to the dealer to pick-up my vehicle once they gather data again.

 

[GLuv]

Update: I got a call for the service tech who informed me that the replacement battery was on its way. Much faster than he initially thought ... which was one month. He also said the battery was a reconditioned unit vs new.

Going in to get it swapped out in two days. I post was the result is when it’s done.