Replacing the single cells in the battery pack?

[JejuSoul]

This is surprising to me, the OBC version is earlier than the one it should have according to the stickers.

The sticker on the EPCU is the correct one for your original car. 12.2E
That you OBD now has a sticker 11.1E suggests that they put in a re-manufactured old box to replace the failed original one.
Most people got a completely new box when their OBD failed. But this is an expensive option if all you need to do is re-solder a burnt capacitor. This is the first example of that cheaper option.
Obviously they would flash newer software onto the OBD chip so you won't have an old software version.

 

[kojairvs]

I see 2018 05 19, it’s not easy to see

 

[kojairvs]

I’m not sure, but OBD dongle would get the informations from OBC, not directly from BMS?
Car Scanner is reliable App, has great range of options and I did connect it to my car from the new phone after putting replacement battery. I guess that it’s recognizing my car’s OBC as the original 2015 Kia EV, regardless what battery I have now. And it’s definitely 2018 on the yellow sticker, BMS has for sure all cells voltages if it’s originally put together. Then must be that OBC can process only 96 cells due to the original programming.
It’s all guessing, I wish that I made few more photos before assembling it to the car

 

[JejuSoul]

I see 2018 05 19, it’s not easy to see

okay - my bad eyesight. So it isn't a new set of cells.
You are totally wrong though about the way OBD apps work.
If you want to know more try looking for my codes for using Torque Pro. Or read through the original Soul Spy thread. ( Not the same as the SoulEVSpy app thread. )

I don't recommend any OBD app anymore because they have no ability to adapt to changing algorithms within the car that occur each time Kia flashes a new update. If you want to do it properly you have to write your own codes for your own car. It is much easier now than when the car was new because most of the codes are the same or similar. However the one code that is most relied on by average users SOH is the very one that Kia changes the most.
I just noticed an example from yesterday :- Soulspy is not working anymore after i got an BMS update.

 

[kojairvs]

Thanks Jeju,
I guess that makes sense to focus on SOH if you are owner with the warranty still in place.
For me it’s irrelevant, no warranty, no possible claim,
I’m more interested in cell voltages fluctuations during my trips, battery percentage drop for the same trip with how many kWh I can charge in to battery for the same span in percentage. This will give me my data for comparison once I have to do some DIY.
In 4 weeks since my battery swap, I made around 2400km, average consumption 19kWh per 100km, it is winter now and Switzerland is not well known for its beaches .
All cells are behaving in uniform manner, none is being temperamental for now.
I’ll continue keeping eye and compare every month my data, but it’s obvious that in spring my range will go up and my consumption per 100 go down.

 

[xsimon90x]

Congratulations on your DIY...I also wanted to evaluate the replacement of 3 cells of my battery (1,2,96) 27Kwh therefore E375.
I have not found anything used around (only a 14x pack from Canada, but they do not ship outside).
I wanted to evaluate the Alibaba cells, but I would need the precise measurements of the individual original packs (NCM 3.7V 37.5Ah).
@kojairvs did you by chance take them?Will the Alibaba ones be good as a formulation?
The discharge values seem plausible to me, while the charge data are limiting (I would still evaluate the 40Ah single cell as they are more common and less used in combination with the worn out originals).
If anyone has news of used battery packs for Soul EV in Europe both E375 and E400, I would be happy to know.

 

[kojairvs]

Congratulations on your DIY...I also wanted to evaluate the replacement of 3 cells of my battery (1,2,96) 27Kwh therefore E375.
I have not found anything used around (only a 14x pack from Canada, but they do not ship outside).
I wanted to evaluate the Alibaba cells, but I would need the precise measurements of the individual original packs (NCM 3.7V 37.5Ah).
@kojairvs did you by chance take them?Will the Alibaba ones be good as a formulation?
The discharge values seem plausible to me, while the charge data are limiting (I would still evaluate the 40Ah single cell as they are more common and less used in combination with the worn out originals).
If anyone has news of used battery packs for Soul EV in Europe both E375 and E400, I would be happy to know.

Hi,
Where are you in Europe?
I did purchase 4 cells from China but they are 2/3 centimeters longer and wouldn’t be safe to put them.

 

[Dondahaka]

I made measurements of cells (E375),
thicker part is 275mm x 115mm x 10,5mm
the entire foil including the thinner ends has 310mm x 128mm (without pads)

I see similar new cells like here https://ancoo.tech/product/sk-40ah-nmc/ , but a little bit longer, capacity higher.

About my last cell replace.
SOH grows from 11% to 48%, I can make about 75km at 20kwh/100km consumption

After testing I see clearly group of cells what loosing voltage much faster. These cells are mostly on front battery that wasn't replaced before.
I will do next replace of these worst cells and range should be extended. Some cells at charging getting 4.2V faster than others, so the potential in new cells is limited. Same effect at discharging, worst cells goes to 3V, new ones stays at 3,5V


from my observations GOM and SOC is calculated based on the worst cells. Tt is enough that one is faulty, then BMS will calculate GOM, SOC and SOH on that one.

I will report results after second cell replacement when I got some time for it

 

[xsimon90x]

Hi,
Where are you in Europe?
I did purchase 4 cells from China but they are 2/3 centimeters longer and wouldn’t be safe to put them.

Hi, I'm writing from Italy.I have a question for you... Were you able to see the voltage of the 4 cells of the new battery pack on the Soul Spy App? Are the 97, 98, 99, 100 (i.e. the upper ones above the passenger seat) excluded from the reading in order?

@Dondahaka Thanks for the measurements, the cells are exactly the ones I saw...
I'm not sure, but I think Kojairvs also bought some, and they would actually be longer.
If they need to be adapted, soldered, etc. it becomes a bit too long as a job (I wanted to do it in a day, relying on a friend's workshop) and not very safe (we don't know what chemistry they have and if they support charging and discharging the Soul EV).Good luck with the next replacements.
You are fitting used 80Ah cells to replace your worn ones, right?

 

[kojairvs]

Hello Italy,

“Hi, I'm writing from Italy.I have a question for you... Were you able to see the voltage of the 4 cells of the new battery pack on the Soul Spy App? Are the 97, 98, 99, 100 (i.e. the upper ones above the passenger seat) excluded from the reading in order?”

I don’t have Soul Spy, I have only Apple gadgets and that’s why I’ve tried first with Carscanner. I was happy with it with my old battery and I didn’t need different app.
As JejuSoul pointed, my replacement battery has 100 cells, one extra on four 14-cell modules.
My app doesn’t see them, I have reading showing 96 cells. There is no way to know which 4 are missing, probably first 4 or last 4.
I’ll bet it is last 4, because graphic shows number 1 is fluctuating more than 3,4… and in the same time 96 doesn’t fluctuate as much.
But I was wrong many times before and who knows…
Maybe if I uninstall my app on one gadget, install it again and choose from list of the cars different newer version of Kia Soul (not sure if it’s on the list) that I will see all 100 cells…, but for now I don’t need this information.
When/if I do need it I will get android and SpySoul app to be sure which cells I have to change.
If you are in the north of Italy, we are neighbors
I’m under 2 hours from Aosta, in Switzerland, French speaking part.
Contact me by email if you need to discuss more, I might have some spare cells…
Write in Italian, I need some practice…
[email protected]

 

[Perez]

 

[wzkied]

I have not found anything used around (only a 14x pack from Canada, but they do not ship outside).

What's 14x and where in Canada did you find this?

 

[Markinson]

According to another EV garage:
"EV Oasis" in Budapest, Hungary,
(https://evoasis.hu/villanyauto-szerviz/ ... only available in Hungarian language)
who has done already 3 projects of replacing single cells in old 27kWh battery, but according to them: this solution does not last long, because the old-BMS is simply killing the cells during time like cancer in human body (organ transplantation does not help, as the cancer kills the new organ). Their experience was that after 3-6 month, BMS is killing again the new cells (and some old cells as well of course). The only long lasting solution is to replace the complete pack to the updated version 30kWh pack.

Their clients' demand generated a queue already for 16pcs 30kWh battery packs, for which they ask ~5500€ + 360€ installation cost.
The queue is very slow, as their source of the new packs (Norway) is being used by others as well, so now everybody wants to have 30kWh type, which is not very common to be available for sale on the used parts market.

Good news for those, who want to buy old cells, that they are selling the old (uninstalled) battery packs (for home solar systems, or for whatever) for around 250€. Now, they have 1pc available, which was driving the Soul for 20km range. Not the best, but it still must have a lot of good cells among the very ****** ones.

I think the other solution is also good, when complete blocks of newer generation cells (Kona, eNiro) are replaced with the old blocks, where the old BMS remains, but the newer gen. cells are not easy to be killed by old BMS, because of their extended Voltage range (min.Voltage lower, max.Voltage higher).

Good luck for Everyone.

 

[kojairvs]

According to another EV garage:
"EV Oasis" in Budapest, Hungary,
(https://evoasis.hu/villanyauto-szerviz/ ... only available in Hungarian language)
who has done already 3 projects of replacing single cells in old 27kWh battery, but according to them: this solution does not last long, because the old-BMS is simply killing the cells during time like cancer in human body (organ transplantation does not help, as the cancer kills the new organ). Their experience was that after 3-6 month, BMS is killing again the new cells (and some old cells as well of course). The only long lasting solution is to replace the complete pack to the updated version 30kWh pack.

Their clients' demand generated a queue already for 16pcs 30kWh battery packs, for which they ask ~5500€ + 360€ installation cost.
The queue is very slow, as their source of the new packs (Norway) is being used by others as well, so now everybody wants to have 30kWh type, which is not very common to be available for sale on the used parts market.

Good news for those, who want to buy old cells, that they are selling the old (uninstalled) battery packs (for home solar systems, or for whatever) for around 250€. Now, they have 1pc available, which was driving the Soul for 20km range. Not the best, but it still must have a lot of good cells among the very ****** ones.

I think the other solution is also good, when complete blocks of newer generation cells (Kona, eNiro) are replaced with the old blocks, where the old BMS remains, but the newer gen. cells are not easy to be killed by old BMS, because of their extended Voltage range (min.Voltage lower, max.Voltage higher).

Good luck for Everyone.

Hi,
I’m interested to purchase this old battery pack with 20km range, if it’s still available, for my diy project, creating power bank for my solar panels.
Can you contact me on my email , please.