Battery Recall for cars with E400 high-voltage battery.

[mariano3113]

A BMS update resets the all the BMS counters to zero.
The only reason the GOM has increased is because of this.
Sometimes it takes a few complete cycles of driving and charging to get it back to a more accurate number.

Was able to travel 98 miles from 100% to 12%.
18 miles of 73mph freeway and the rest was 45-55mph city streets (Mckellips on Indian Reservation goes up to 55mph speed limit). 2 people with AC set at 70 degrees fahrenheit and ambient temperature of 99°F.


Back in November with no Heat or cooling turned on I could only travel 68 miles on surface streets with a 5%-94% DC session putting 14kWh back into the battery.

After the "BMS" reset my DC session from 12% to 94% had 25kWh delivered.

It is possible that the long ideal sitting of about 6 months and resetting of BMS may have helped load balance my cells/pouches.

Otherwise I should have seen the same degraded range and capacity from before when favorable temperatures were 60-70°F ambient.

Personally, I still think the battery is bad and will go back to only taking 14-15kWh during a near empty to full DC session like before**

 

[JejuSoul]

Interesting data. That's a 50% improvement in real range.
Some may be due to it being a warmer day. But not the greater part.
Your idea that the cells may have thoroughly re-balanced is a good one.
Please post more data in a month or two.

 

[mariano3113]

Interesting data. That's a 50% improvement in real range.
Some may be due to it being a warmer day. But not the greater part.
Your idea that the cells may have thoroughly re-balanced is a good one.
Please post more data in a month or two.

I will follow-up in a month.

Oddly when I lost power accelerating through a light in Jan 2023 went from 30% to 0% dead and would not AC nor DC Charge.

-Mark Kia had to reset BMS in order for car to start AC charging again.
I was only getting around 67 miles of range of surface street driving and less than 50 miles of doing 65mph+Freeway driving.
(I thought the battery was bad, but after they did the BMS flash plus charged the battery...they said the battery was 97% State of Health)

*That was 99k miles ...the battery was put in at 33k or 36k miles.

Less than month later the OBC died and was replaced at Horne Kia. Since then the Soul EV in Chargepoint App has been reporting at peak rate of 6.9kW instead of the usual 6.6kW I was previously seeing for years.

Range did go up to around 80-90 after the OBC replacement, but hot summer and frequent DC charging I saw the range going back down to figures on previous post.
(Assumed the 133 days of 100°F+/54 days of 110°F+ was taking a toll on the battery.
Reduced power when DC charging and could only accelerate to drive surface streets.)

Arizona Phoenix Valley really isn't suitable for Air Cooled EV, but battery has surprised me.

I won't be using the soul to transport appliances or building materials (tile/mortar/drywall/etcetera) now that I have the F150 Lightning solely for those tasks.
(Also my frequent 8 cents per kWh CHAdeMO charger in Scottsdale is no more.)
Now the Soul is my go-to run about vehicle within a 30-mile one-way.
Extended Warranty lasts until 150k miles or 2027...I'm at 110k miles and will probly hit the mileage before 2027.

Hoping to replace my Niro with an newer Genesis EV or Lucid Gravity in a year or 2 and then keep the Soul as the city runabout until it dies.

 

[ReggiesRide510510]

I also got the Turtle mode (@ 65%SOC ?!? ) twice in 2 days back in Dec. '23 after the recall repair was done in October 2023. The car was driving GREAT until the recall repair. First turtle mode was fixed with a "manual software reset". Second time, I just had it towed to the dealership where it's been since the 1st week of Dec. 2023. Both times had to have a tow since unable to drive on freeway on turtle. (2016 EV+ with the original battery replaced Nov. 2020 as documented on this forum). I got approved for another new battery pack but get conflicting timelines for battery arrival -- dealer says late Feb./March; KiaUSA says no ETA date. No loaner available from the dealership so I've had to get a car rental out of pocket (Chevy Bolt and now Hyundai Kona EV). I just hope to get reimbursed when this is all done. Thanks for reading & good luck to all out there.

UPDATE:
Got news today June 4, '24 that my car has been fixed with a "software update" & no batterypack replacement. Hopefully, it will be ready to be picked up sometime today after they replace the dead 12V battery since it has been sitting so long.( at my cost...ugh), and after washing/vacuuming car. For context, my car has been in the shop since Dec. 2023.
I hope this means they have also fixed the NHTSA Recall #23C724 (SC287) which specifies the "parking mechanism may be damaged...resulting in unintended vehicle movement." Will update again. Thanks.

 

[ReggiesRide510510]

UPDATE:
Got news today June 4, '24 that my car has been fixed with a "software update" & no batterypack replacement. Hopefully, it will be ready to be picked up sometime today after they replace the dead 12V battery since it has been sitting so long.( at my cost...ugh), and after washing/vacuuming car. For context, my car has been in the shop since Dec. 2023.
I hope this means they have also fixed the NHTSA Recall #23C724 (SC287) which specifies the "parking mechanism may be damaged...resulting in unintended vehicle movement." Will update once I actually GET the car & have driven it. Thanks.

 

[mariano3113]

I will follow-up in a month.

Oddly when I lost power accelerating through a light in Jan 2023 went from 30% to 0% dead and would not AC nor DC Charge.

-Mark Kia had to reset BMS in order for car to start AC charging again.
I was only getting around 67 miles of range of surface street driving and less than 50 miles of doing 65mph+Freeway driving.
(I thought the battery was bad, but after they did the BMS flash plus charged the battery...they said the battery was 97% State of Health)

*That was 99k miles ...the battery was put in at 33k or 36k miles.

Less than month later the OBC died and was replaced at Horne Kia. Since then the Soul EV in Chargepoint App has been reporting at peak rate of 6.9kW instead of the usual 6.6kW I was previously seeing for years.

Range did go up to around 80-90 after the OBC replacement, but hot summer and frequent DC charging I saw the range going back down to figures on previous post.
(Assumed the 133 days of 100°F+/54 days of 110°F+ was taking a toll on the battery.
Reduced power when DC charging and could only accelerate to drive surface streets.)

Arizona Phoenix Valley really isn't suitable for Air Cooled EV, but battery has surprised me.

I won't be using the soul to transport appliances or building materials (tile/mortar/drywall/etcetera) now that I have the F150 Lightning solely for those tasks.
(Also my frequent 8 cents per kWh CHAdeMO charger in Scottsdale is no more.)
Now the Soul is my go-to run about vehicle within a 30-mile one-way.
Extended Warranty lasts until 150k miles or 2027...I'm at 110k miles and will probly hit the mileage before 2027.

Hoping to replace my Niro with an newer Genesis EV or Lucid Gravity in a year or 2 and then keep the Soul as the city runabout until it dies.

Okay it didn't last a month.

Just got back home when trying from 60~ish mile round trip (Freeway 70+mph) and vehicle sputtered coming into my neighborhood at 33% indicated State of charge.


I will be taking back to the dealer tomorrow morning as the EV! And turtle mode are back.

So May 29, 2024 vehicle picked up from dealer with 110,520 miles

It is now June 4th 2024 110,774 miles and Turtle mode and EV service warning came on above 30% SoC.

Maybe I'll get that new battery after-all.

Will probably be a couple days before I get another loaner vehicle.

 

[Matt98765]

My 2016 Kia Soul EV 2016 has been at the dealership 204 days with no end in sight (National Back Order) for the NHTSA recall number 23V218/SC267-
F101-1241 , we were tracking in late December 2023 a new high voltage Battery from Korea to California to customs to the Kia dealership in Eastern Tennessee with Linda from KIA customer care giving updates. She also stated she was in charge of ordering for the EV batteries, My battery and Linda have vanished into a black hole.

Kia customer care is ignoring us totally, case has been escalated and the new case worker is a joke.

Suspect they gave away my new battery E400 that we were waiting on in late December 2023.

Every time I call I get a different response, Your battery is part of a national recall, Your car was never part of the recall, You never received such a letter, Only thing we owe you is a gear for the electric park break, One girl had a ohh shit moment but would not tell me anything.

I have done everything they asked of me and paid full price for everything including the tow to the dealership.

No loaner car, wife has been without a vehicle for 204 days and counting.

Any advice will be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[ksoul2084]

Absolutely outrageous. I'd go to whatever local TV media you have there, maybe they have a consumer-issues type segment they run.

 

[mariano3113]

My 2016 Kia Soul EV 2016 has been at the dealership 204 days with no end in sight (National Back Order) for the NHTSA recall number 23V218/SC267-
F101-1241 , we were tracking in late December 2023 a new high voltage Battery from Korea to California to customs to the Kia dealership in Eastern Tennessee with Linda from KIA customer care giving updates. She also stated she was in charge of ordering for the EV batteries, My battery and Linda have vanished into a black hole.

Kia customer care is ignoring us totally, case has been escalated and the new case worker is a joke.

Suspect they gave away my new battery E400 that we were waiting on in late December 2023.

Every time I call I get a different response, Your battery is part of a national recall, Your car was never part of the recall, You never received such a letter, Only thing we owe you is a gear for the electric park break, One girl had a ohh shit moment but would not tell me anything.

I have done everything they asked of me and paid full price for everything including the tow to the dealership.

No loaner car, wife has been without a vehicle for 204 days and counting.

Any advice will be appreciated.

Thanks

Strongly concur on contacting a 3-on-your side type media outlet to have them give your issue some voice and traction.

My local Horne Kia dealer has been better in terms of loaners or even rentals compared to Mark Kia here in Gilbert/Phoenix/Scottsdale area.

Kia sent me an email that they are working with my Dealer.

204 days is far too long and definitely would sour any chance of faith or loyalty in the brand and/or dealer.

 

[faf625]

I feel you're pain. I'm at202 days.

 

[Matt98765]

Absolutely outrageous. I'd go to whatever local TV media you have there, maybe they have a consumer-issues type segment they run.

Have twice attempted to contact Mr. Don Dare with no response, Did file yesterday a formal complaint with the BBB with a copy of the letter and envelope of the original recall notice.

Thanks

 

[ReggiesRide510510]

UPDATE:
Car has been back for a week or so after the dealership did the software update and so far so good!!! Holds charge overnight, range is similar to what I remember, street and freeway driving speeds are normal. I think I was lucky; mine was 3 out of 6 cars that the software updated worked at the dealership. Not sure what happened to the other cars.
Hopefully, this is the last of the major upsets for a while.

For other context, a "new" battery pack had been ordered and since early this year had arrived was "somewhere in the U.S." but this software update seemed to have done the trick. KiaCorp also knew about the update and had asked if my dealership had done that service.

Now trying to get reimbursed from KiaCorp. for my out of pocket rental costs during the repair period.
Good luck to all!

 

[mariano3113]

Okay it didn't last a month.

Just got back home when trying from 60~ish mile round trip (Freeway 70+mph) and vehicle sputtered coming into my neighborhood at 33% indicated State of charge.


I will be taking back to the dealer tomorrow morning as the EV! And turtle mode are back.

So May 29, 2024 vehicle picked up from dealer with 110,520 miles

It is now June 4th 2024 110,774 miles and Turtle mode and EV service warning came on above 30% SoC.

Maybe I'll get that new battery after-all.

Will probably be a couple days before I get another loaner vehicle.

While vehicle is till at the dealer and undergoing "Flight tests" ...I received a new letter attached about an additional BMS update dated June 4th.


Main point from letter:
• Kia is aware that your vehicle's BMS was previously replaced and updated under NHTSA Recall #23V218 (Kia'a Reference number #SC267) to detect abnormal battery cell voltage conditions. After this replacement and software update, you may not be able to charge your vehicle beyond 80% capacity in certain circumstances. To correct this condition, Kia has recently made improvements to the software and is conducting this Voluntary Service Campaign to have the latest software version installed on your vehicle.


When I got vehicle back from on May 29th, I was able to charge to 100% everyday until June 3rd after it gave me EV warning and turtle light at 32%.
•Then it only charged to 82% overnight and remains in turtle mode with EV service warning until I limped vehicle to dealer on June 4th.

 

[kimdavi]

I received this letter as well. Kia's letter is misleading, particularly in its wording about 'certain circumstances.' The phrase 'you may not be able to charge your vehicle beyond 80% capacity in certain circumstances' refers to a condition where an 'Abnormal Battery Cell Voltage' is triggered, which also causes the car to revert to power-limp mode. This critical detail is never mentioned. In my opinion, the letter emphasizes the least important symptom—the 80% charging limit—rather than the urgent need to address the power-limited issue.

Two weeks ago, the Kia dealership installed the latest BMS software update, but it didn't resolve my critical issue. My 2015 Kia Soul EV remains in power-limp mode, and I have received no updates from Kia regarding the status of a second battery recall replacement.

 

[Matt98765]

The previous BMS software update lied, The guess ometer said I had seven more miles range on my 2016 KIA Soul EV when it died on the side of the road three miles from home.

207 days at the dealership and counting.

 

[spidermonkey]

229 days...I got a couple of interesting e-mails from Kia. One was a "Good Will Payment" offer. The other was a "Buy Out Offer". The "Good Will Offer" was a non disclosure agreement, they pay me X amount of dollars and agree to fix my car in a reasonable amount of time, in exchange for me not commenting on Kia again, ever. What kind of company wants you to sign a non disclosure agreement over a warranty issue? A company that has a lot of bad reputation building up, a company with no integrity. The "Buy Out" clearly states that it is a "Non Lemon Law Purchase" and is woefully below the Kelly Blue Book price range they quoted me from. I countered both offers with what I felt to be a reasonable amount of money that would both make me whole as well as establish genuine good will towards the company. A flat NO was the response.

Fixing our cars in a reasonable amount of time turns out to be geological time. Kia turned trillions of dollars in profits last year. Trillions, not millions, not billions but TRILLIONS of dollars. Their stock price is up 40%. Now they are paying out hush money.

I'm at a crossroads, the money they are offering me combined isnt enough to get me into another electric vehicle. The nondisclosure agreement is time sensitive and has no repair date attached, and its just fucking sleazy.

This is the kind of capitalism and lack of equity that I really hate the most. I am poor as a monkey, I cant afford the rental car price...hell if I could afford the rental I would actually be driving a Subaru EV. I dont know about the rest of you but I feel like I'm being punished for being poor and punching above my weight.

Corporations fuckin' suck.

 

[JejuSoul]

... What kind of company wants you to sign a non disclosure agreement over a warranty issue?

Nissan probably did this in 2012 for the Leaf.
All the people who had been complaining disappeared off the forums, hence I have no evidence to prove this. It seems Kia's ability to manage their PR is less effective.

 

[Locuturus]

not surprised though granted, at least my local Kia (Kia South Vancouver) was helpful to a certain extent - though my original dealer was pretty shitty at it (and now that I look at it later they do a hefty markup on all their cars, even used - would not ever recommend Kia West in Coquitlam, BC btw)

It feels like communities where EV adoption isn't high there's less incentive to do anything - read: less likely to appear in national or local news as an EV issue.

After my OBC update (following the reman battery replacement), the check ev system light kept coming on (no discernable signs or problems), and it seems they flashed a software update to the BMS, drove it around for 48 hours, and gave me back the car. OK so far - and I drove it down to 26% and charged it back up - says 170km range now on the GOM, drove 8km and got 172km W_W go figure.

But at least this particular service dept was better at answering questions - though you do have to be proactive and ask for help, best if you can get past the service rep and go to the tech, who has a better idea of what is actually going on than the rep.

 

[Matt98765]

When the car was purchased in 2016 new it had 91 miles range.

At the time of of the last BMS update the car said it would only charge to 75 miles range max.

It was nice to see 91 miles again on the guess-O-meter again but being an electronic technician I knew it was one big lie that would end up biting me in the butt. Sure enough did and the wife had told me not to take the long way back home.

 

[Cliff]

229 days...I got a couple of interesting e-mails from Kia. One was a "Good Will Payment" offer. The other was a "Buy Out Offer". The "Good Will Offer" was a non disclosure agreement, they pay me X amount of dollars and agree to fix my car in a reasonable amount of time, in exchange for me not commenting on Kia again, ever. What kind of company wants you to sign a non disclosure agreement over a warranty issue? A company that has a lot of bad reputation building up, a company with no integrity. The "Buy Out" clearly states that it is a "Non Lemon Law Purchase" and is woefully below the Kelly Blue Book price range they quoted me from. I countered both offers with what I felt to be a reasonable amount of money that would both make me whole as well as establish genuine good will towards the company. A flat NO was the response.

Fixing our cars in a reasonable amount of time turns out to be geological time. Kia turned trillions of dollars in profits last year. Trillions, not millions, not billions but TRILLIONS of dollars. Their stock price is up 40%. Now they are paying out hush money.

I'm at a crossroads, the money they are offering me combined isnt enough to get me into another electric vehicle. The nondisclosure agreement is time sensitive and has no repair date attached, and its just fucking sleazy.

This is the kind of capitalism and lack of equity that I really hate the most. I am poor as a monkey, I cant afford the rental car price...hell if I could afford the rental I would actually be driving a Subaru EV. I dont know about the rest of you but I feel like I'm being punished for being poor and punching above my weight.

Corporations fuckin' suck.

Same here. I was considering one of the options when, after 270 days, Kia said my car was "repaired." Since then they have not returned my emails re the two offers.